Alright. Alright, so I’ve got the one seat locked, that will be for our friend Roberto.
This is coffee.” That’s coffee. Hi. So, let's get started. We got people in the room, so let’s do this. So, this is our first Blab together, so hey everyone. Thanks for those of you who are hopping in with us. So, we're going to jump right in and glad you all could join us today. My name is Dean Petrulakis, I’m senior VP for Business Development at Rider Dickerson in Chicago. We’re a printing marketing solutions provider in this wonderful city of Chicago, and I have two of my favorite peeps here with me today. This is all about – This is our first Blab together. I’ve done one other Blab, but this is the first I’ve done with my two friends here. So, I have Deborah Corn and Trish Witkowski here. I’m going to have both of them introduce themselves to you folks in a minute. Deborah will be the resident comedian here. This will be fun. And, we're going to have a friend of ours hop in, in a little bit, and of course, those of you familiar with Blab know that you can – when the seat is available you can knock on it and we can let you in, and you can join our conversation. Today, we're going to be talking about Leveraging Content to Grow Your Audience and Gain Engagement and Loyal Fans. We’re each going to come at it from a different perspective because we’re all doing it in a different way, especially these two rock stars here with me. It’s really going to be – I’m going to mostly moderate today and allow these two to share some of their wisdom, as well as Roberto when he hops in. Let’s start with a couple quick intros here. Deborah, my friend, why don’t you introduce yourself to those who don’t know you.
My name is Deborah Corn and I am the intergalactic ambassador to the printerverse at printmediacentr.com. I provide information and resources to the print integrated marketing community with a little fun in the mix. We were practicing value propositions at #PrintChat yesterday, so hopefully that was a value proposition, and if you need information and resources and want to have a little fun, you’ll check out Print Media Centr. I also have very strong ties to the print community. I run the Print Professional Group on LinkedIn. It's the number one print group. There’s 92 plus thousand members in it, which I started a long time ago by myself, and run it by myself since. Weekly #PrintChat reaches over 8 million timelines, lots of social media presence, lots of content, happy to be here, try the VL, Trish.”
Cool. That was awesome. I’m Trish Witkowski from foldfactory.com. I also have another community called rockthemailbox.com. And, let’s see, I’m a designer with a master's degree in print and I have a video series called 60-second Super Cool Fold of the Week. I’ve been doing that for about six years, I think almost seven. You know, 50 videos a year, every single week. I'm on 332 this week. It just went out this morning. I just shot it right here. That’s where the magic happens.” I watched it already.
Did you?” That’s where the magic happens. It’s true. There’s your plant. It’s that plant.”
On the plant.”
It’s the plant.” The fern, the magic fern, we all call it.
Folds between the ferns. That would be hysterical. Between the ferns. Folds between the ferns would be hysterical.”
Yes. So, I've been pushing out creative ideas every single week for six years. We've got a lot of subscribers to the Fold of the Week email. We also have a pretty active YouTube channel with about 500 videos on it, 1.2 million views and five thousand subscribers to the Fold of the Week email. I mean, not the email, the YouTube channel. So, you know we've just grown organically over the years through pushing out content, doing a lot of different things. So, yes.” Awesome. That’s awesome. And, I know when Roberto gets in with us later, he'll tell us a little bit of his story, what he's doing. He's done some pretty wild things that are on YouTube and build up his own little community.
Yes. I told everybody he was coming.”
I busted out a secret. What about you Dean?” Yes. So, it’s interesting. So, it is interesting, the connection that the three of us have, you know, through Print Forum which we’ll talk about, but – Now as I’ve mentioned, I’ve worked with Rider Dickerson, so as I’ve mentioned print marketing services, and I've been doing this for almost 20 years now. And really, the last, I would say, probably seven or eight years is where I’ve seen the biggest growth in my career when I got a lot more diversified in what I was doing in. And, quite honestly, when I started getting involved more in content, both creation and curation, and hooking up with people like yourselves when I started Print Forum, and that really kind of changed things for me. It put me on the map in a different way. It allowed me to meet some great people on this industry and to be able to do things like this. So, I’m such a firm believer, and you guys both know this, in giving value. And, you know, the last Blab that I did was all about adding value to the customer experience and I'm a firm believer in that, that you should always give more value than you give back. And, that's the way I kind of roll in my sales career. I always tell people I'm kind of like the atypical sales rep. When I’m not out selling people, I'm really more about building relationships and building my own, what I would call, engaged and loyal and community of clients. But really, it is about that adding value and educating, do Print Forumer educating. I’m about to do an educational workshop today with a group of college students that are coming to Rider Dickerson and we're going to do kind of a print 101 type of thing. They’re a good client of mine and I help them once a year, sometimes twice a year, do a little educational workshop at our place and kind of taking them from the classroom into the print shop, and kind of showing them how it all works and come together. So, that's just been the way I've done things and I just find that it’s the best way to do. And, speaking of our guest, I’m going to let our guest in because he's knocking on the door right now, so we might as well get him in.
Awesome.” So, let's let our friend Roberto join. Roberto.
Hey everyone, how’s it going?”
Roberto’s here.” Roberto, the secret guest. The secret guest. Yes, we can hear you. We can see you again. Glad you could join us man.
Great to see you.”
Great to see everybody face to face to face.” Yes. I’m glad we can pull this off. It's not easy getting everyone's schedules together.
We are a motley-looking Brady Bunch. I just want to say.” Yes. Aren’t we? That’s cool.
Somebody should screenshot this.”
I’ll do it.” Go ahead, Deborah. Screenshot it.
Got it. Everybody smile. Got it.” Alright.
Christine.” Yes, put it out. Put it out. So, Roberto, we were just getting into some intros. Why don’t you give us a little background on yourself and then we're going to pop in and start getting into a little bit of conversation, but just tell us a little bit about and tell the people in the room little bit about your story. So, I'm a creative entrepreneur. I have 10 years plus experience in design advertising and marketing. I really started with web design ironically before going to print and digital all-around. At this point, I do a lot in the content marketing space and a lot of it in around educating and motivating other creative professionals, as well as consulting businesses and brands, and what they can do to do exactly what we're talking about here, leverage content, grow their audience, help them with their brand messaging, and even the execution on some of their identity stuff and even the technical nuts and bolts of the execution sometimes. I'm right now very much well known for the fact that since doing weekly content in 2003 around creative professionals, I’ve grown a YouTube channel of over 90,000 subscribers.”
Premium Roberto, man. It rocks.”
More like – I feel those numbers are fantastic. I'm very proud of that because I don't look at them as the vanity metric that other people would because, since my channel is a how-to channel, I look at that as customer serve, I look at that as people have been served and have gained value, and that I've help. And, knowing that, ‘Wow! You helped almost a hundred thousand human beings.’ That feels like a real tremendous accomplishment more than, ‘Oh, you built a following on YouTube.’ It’s like, ‘No. I helped people in their actual creative journey, in their lives.’ Some people actually now have the job that they want or able to build a career that they want and are the way to having the life that they want, and that's what I’m really proud of. And, it also helped me grow my business, my personal brand. And, I’ve been doing speaking engagements, I’ve been doing a lot more consulting to the point where consulting is overtaken my design and creative practice to where it’s more, people want to know how to grow their business get more customers, get some more clients, and after that, then they all hire me to help in making their stuff look better.”
If I could just interject one thing. It’s because you think of your community that way Roberto that you have such a loyal community. If you are actually trying to sell them something, you wouldn’t have 90,000 subscribers. So, kudos to you for just being freaking awesome. And, I snagged him to write for news for the printerverse, just so everybody knows. So, subscribe to that damn thing and read his article. They’re very popular.” Very good, very good.
We’ve been doing that for about what, a year now?”
Yes. And, I found you because you’re on social media sharing amazing content about making video marketing quite frankly, and I was like, why isn’t this guy with me? And, thank God, you said, ‘Hey, I’d love to be.’ So, yes, frigging social media. That’s how I know you, that’s how I know you and that’s how I know him.” Yes, that’s true.
Anyone who underestimates the value of social media is underestimating the value of human connection because it’s social media. Media is the gateway to the conversation. So, it's fine to push out, push out things because guess what, if I didn't push out, push out things, there wouldn’t be people who decided, ‘I really enjoyed that. Thank you so much’, so that I can then say, ‘Well, thank you for enjoying what you get the most of.’ And then, we have an opportunity to connect and to grow and to learn together. I built so many relationships through tweets. It's ridiculous.”
Yes. The fun really is in kind of pushing out, kind of sharing your passion and pushing out great content. I think the challenge, I think for all of us who push out a decent volume of content is keeping the quality up, you know. It's that, you have to keep the quality up, you know, to keep your community and to keep the energy and to keep people interested. So, I think that’s – Yes.”
Let’s quantify quality because I think that, like it’s easy to say quality and then people sometimes get confused. So, with regards to what we’re talking about, if it’s video, sometimes people think quality is, ‘I have an HD camera and I have a really good content.’”
That’s a good point. It’s the quality of the content itself and the material you're creating.”
Now, as print professionals, we also know production values matter with everything as well. So, I would say that if we're going to talk about quality, it has to be, yes, the production values of whatever you're putting out there in the world whatever the content is, but then also it could be the quality experience, and that also means that the relationship value, the customer service value. Meaning that, if you push something out on social media, well how good are you at engaging after the fact that how good are you at following up with people who favored and liked, and how good are you at replying to tweets or to comments or at the end of the engagement angle of it after the quality of the production, but then the quality of the content itself, whether it's information or entertainment or infotainment, motivation or whatever it is. Well, how motivating was it or how informative was it or how fun was it or how fun and informative was it, you know. I think that from my perspective, that's kind of how we define quality content, and I think I should probably do a video and an article about that at some point because I think that matters.” Yes. I just think you just started to write your next article. You know, it’s bigger than that. That’s a kind of good transition because Deborah, you and I were talking the other day, and we talked about quality. So, one of the things you told me is that, you know, you got started not so much through content but by community. I mean, Print Production Professionals is how you and I met, and one of the things that drew me to your group was that when I joined your group, you sent a personal message to me, like you do probably to everybody I’m assuming, because that's just kind of how you are, and you explained how the group works, and I just right off the bat said, ‘Well this is different than any other group I’ve ever joined’, and you said, the challenge for you though was, once you started to build a community with, what were you going to do to keep that community engaged. So, why don’t you stick a little bit about that challenge that faced you and how you addressed that? Obviously, you’ve evolved so much since you and I first met, seven or eight years ago.
Yes. And, thanks for that. I mean, at a certain point, you know, when I started the group in 2008, it was just me and 30 people and I was really almost embarrassed. I was like, ‘I need to get my name off this thing.’ I don’t want me and 30 people thinking I had this big LinkedIn group, and then slowly it got momentum and add about 5000 people when the – People in this website came along and said, ‘You know, we have a website, no audience. You have an audience, no website. So, why don’t we, you know, kind of make chocolate peanut butter and then make something happen here.’ So, pretty much what happened after that is – Okay. There was a limitation to what you could do on LinkedIn. There was a limitation to what you could share, how it could be shared and how people can engage with it and who you could drive to those conversations. So, what the group enabled me to do was to have a unique perspective about what was talkable to the community members, because they were discussing it. Then, I could take those concepts and go out to the manufacturers and to the printers and to the designers and say, ‘Okay. How are you doing this because this is very topical? People want to know what's going on here. So, I was able to use content to support the interests of the communities, and the community was large enough that it actually gave me access to these people and these companies. Because, prior to me walking in a room by myself, it was like, who is this person? Now, I walk in and it's like, ‘Okay, it's her, but there’s over a hundred thousand people with her.’ So, we kind of, it's not like they have to talk to me, but they kind of can't ignore us, and so content has become a door opener in a lot of ways, as well as a way of serving the community that I have cultivated. Now, I don’t believe that I own the print community. I don't, but I showed them a different way by helping them tell their own stories as well.”
It’s because you’ve become a true thought leader and influencer. You know, there's going to be a point where I'm doing one of my speaking engagement where I do this talk called, The Eight Es of Thought Leadership, and like a big section of that is the fact that you can be a thought leader by educating your community and educating the people who are following you, but you can also enable them, you can encourage them, you can empower them, you can help eliminate barriers to success and excuses, you can set examples for them, and also, it's your value as an executioner. So, you are executing as a print professional. You are then educating not only your community but then educating the facilitators in terms of the service providers, the vendors, the manufacturers by saying, ‘Look, I have access to your baits and we’re all together more talking, so I know these pain points that you’re doing spending millions of dollars in market research to try and understand your community better.’ It’s called – I can reduce that friction a lot. It's called, well talk to me, I'm in the trades, I'm in the trenches, and also if I go to bat for you, they'll believe me because I've done all this other stuff for them. I’ve eliminated barriers to success for people. I’ve set examples for people, I’ve enabled them, I’ve educated them, and I’ve encouraged them. So, when I say that, ‘Hey, this is reliable.’ They're more likely to hear it and take it from me than someone else, and that's why in points are marketing matters, and that's why, like, you know, Gary Vaynerchuk, somebody I'm sure everyone here is familiar with from the marketing world, I mean, I'm going to shamelessly plug his book right now, the #AskGaryVee.” I was going to talk about that one with you Roberto.
There’s a whole chapter in here specifically about influencer marketing, and something you guys know, I'm very passionate about it. Just remember, well back once upon time as a marketing manager, I used to be Google AdWords account manager. I was a web design SEO guy, and I'm telling you guys flat out that influencer marketing, human beings like us who build community through – Yes, we do things through SEO, we do things through this content marketing, but at the end of the day, the net value of our influence and our ability to move that and our ability to monetize messages, is going to crush PPC. It’s going to crush paid advertisers. It’s going to crush SEO. It’s not going to completely eliminate or replace it, but it’s going to be disproportionately more valued, because it's more cost effective and more impactful for the businesses shelling out the ad dollars. And, I’ve sat in every chair. I’ve sat in the – I’ve been a marketing manager. I’ve sat in the ‘ad buying’ chair. I’ve sat in the ‘I’m making the ads’ chair. I’ve sat in the ‘we got to sell it’ chair. I’ve done every one of these things, buying, selling, making and the like. So, I have actually the unique perspective of sitting every one of those chairs, and now as a business owner, I can say, ‘You know what, when my book comes out, yes, I might do PPC ads with Amazon because of the remarketing and because that will follow people to Facebook and I don’t have to pay Facebook, and it makes sense to trust Amazon. Sure. Not to mention, like, my proportions of revenue there, but I would go and I would say, ‘You know what, I'm going to have Deborah review this book. I'm going to have Trish review this book. I’m going to have Dean review this book, because it’s going to let me access their following, and I’m paying a one-time cost instead of like, PPC, for stuff that may or may not convert. They have a loyal following that trusts them and they have influence, so I can quantify that better.’ And, the thing is, it may cost me nothing. It might be better to give them a copy of the book and a few copies to give away to their audience because then, they get the value attraction from running a contest and they can leverage that for whatever they want, or they could tell people, ‘Hey, the next five customers of mine will get a free copy of the book when they do business with me.’ Like, you guys do whatever you want with a promo. I don't need the control and also, I don’t have to overthink, I don’t have to do market research, I don’t have to do any of that. You realize how cost effective that is for a business?” No, it's true because you just watch it all play out, because I know you're a big fan of Gary V be and so am I. Either way, he just went about promoting and then starting to sell his book. It was genius, you know. The guy’s a – He’s a modern marketing genius, and you know, he's got so many good things to say, and I can’t wait to read his book either. I’ve watch all his shows, but it's true, indeed. One of the things Gary talks about and you know, the three of you can speak to this, is the idea that it doesn't happen overnight. Gary was, you know, for seven or eight years was quiet and no one was hearing from him, and now he’s out there. He can do all this stuff because he built up the resume to be able to authentically speak about what he does, you know, Trish, Roberto, Deborah, you all have done the same thing. And,, you know what’s interesting Trish from your perspective, you know, you came out of nowhere in a sense, but it really wasn't out of nowhere because you put in all that work. It’s kind of put you in the map.
Yes. It's been almost 20 years. I mean, I think a lot of people don't realize that about me, but I’ve been a researcher, you know, for a very long time, and I just started researching folding. It started as a thesis project for my master’s degree, and then I realized that there were no resources for folding. I realized there's a lot that could be done that nobody knew about and I started documenting and you know, all of this stuff and collecting all of this stuff, and the funny part about the video work and what has really put me on the map is, I really just – It was kind of on the edge, you know, it was six or seven years ago before people were really talking about content marketing and before – You know, it was just kind of on the edge of when people were putting things on YouTube and experimenting with it and you know, and I just said, ‘I’ll just do this video.’ I just feel like people need this information I feel like I have these ideas to share and I can’t get to people and you know, it was an experiment, and it turned into what is now a part of my life. I mean, it’s a weekly series that doesn't, you know, it's indefinite. I don't know. I think I'm going to be doing it the rest of my life, I mean, you know. So, it's kind of this funny thing that just picked up momentum and I think, you know, a lot of it has to do with just that authenticity of just really wanting to share your knowledge. You know, Roberto touched on this, you know, the idea of saying, ‘You know what, I just really want to share my knowledge and help people. Yes, I'm a business owner. I definitely want to make money, but the content is about the content, and it's about educating people and sharing your knowledge and building those relationships. And, you know, Roberto was talking about doing the speaking events and things like that and how content has been helpful to his career, and one of the things that I’ve found with my video work, when we’re doing work for sharing ideas with designers and printers and things, is you find too that audiences, it’s like they know you before you know them, and you get this very welcome. There’s like an energy in the room that happens versus hitting a cold room, in like the early days of doing events where nobody knows who we are and you’re kind of introducing yourself and trying to get some rapport with the audience, and you come in and people are like, ‘Trish!’ you know. It’s like, they know you, they’re excited to hear what you have to say, and I feel like people leave energized, they're engaged while they’re with you, they’re energized and they're ready to, you know, they're just there soaking in the information and they're excited to go apply it. And, I feel like that momentum and that energy has just increased kind of exponentially over the past few years as I really picked up speed, I mean, it's just – But, you know, it's a noticeable difference over kind of the earlier days of trying to kind of get your feet wet and establish your reputation and all that. You kind of – I don’t know where that critical mass is, but at some point you almost hit a critical mass or a tipping point or whatever you want to call it, where all of a sudden it's like, ‘Okay. Things are clicking, things make sense, audiences show up, people are excited, they jump on it.’ I can't put my finger on when that happens.”
I think it’s the number of executions. I don't think it’s a matter of how much time. I think that everyone over –”
Where did he left? I just want to quickly interject that, a couple of years ago, Trish and I were at Dscoop together, and it was interesting in this phenomenon of all of a sudden everybody knows who we are and we literally – It was like, we were like Brad and Angelina. I mean, I can’t even think about it. We couldn't walk together.”
We were hiding behind a column.”
We hid behind the column by an escalator, and only people going down the escalator could see us and they were coming back up the other side to take pictures with us. And, we were both sitting there like, ‘Oh my God, what in the world is going on?’ It was so crazy.”
It was so funny. I forgot about that. That was so funny.”
That was like the first time – That and the first time I went to Grab Expo and I was just walking down the aisle, and literally some of the big people from the big men – I mean, those front booths, you know, the money booths, were like literally dropping everything they were doing and running out and say, ‘Oh my God, you’re Deborah Corn.’ And I was like, ‘Oh my God. What the hell is going on here?’ you know, it was really, really strange to have that. And, I agree, with me it's a little different because I just assumed that with 90 to thousand people in my LinkedIn group that that's how they know me, you know. But, that's not always the case, and to your point, I don’t know when it happened either, but it's definitely interesting to have that notoriety, so to speak. It’s a little weird and uncomfortable too, quite frankly, because it’s like, God I’m just like, you know I feel like celebrities. They’re like everybody else. You know, it’s like, I’m just walking down a trade show, ‘Hi. How are you?’ It’s like people surrounding me. So, it’s very weird, humbling, uncomfortable.”
But it's fun.”
I'm so humbled by that now, like, if that’s the right term for it in the sense that it’s like, I respect now what these people who are, and I don't equate us like – I don’t equate us with celebrities, but like the word public figure sounds appropriate, because it's that, when you're recognizable, when you’re someone of note, when you're
noteworthy”. We might be in real life, the iTunes equivalent of new and noteworthy but in the real world, and so -- Because like, the internet – Of course, the internet knows who we are, right? But, in the real world, people are starting to recognize us and take notice of, ‘Hey, that’s so and so’, and everything like that. I mean, this is really interesting, and I realized like, when I met Gary Vaynerchuk at the 92Y event in New York, like how much in real life he's just seriously a good guy and is really just a guy. A guy who’s done amazing and great and accomplished things that is freaking brilliant as a marketer and a business person, but at the end of the day, just a guy in the same way that we’ve had our accolades and we have our fans, in the way that, you know, we're fans of his. We have fans of ours who feel that way about us, you know, in that same way in a very adamant passion. I mean, there was this like – This kid picked me out of like, I was in Manhattan taking pictures on the corner of a street, testing out something with my iPhone and like, this guy like, actually picked up his pace and everything like that. I was like, ‘What's good?’ and, he’s like, ‘You’re Roberto Blake from YouTube.’ And, I was like, ‘Oh wow, really. This is happening.’ So, like, I've done that. I’ve gone to conventions where I'm just taking photos, you know, I'm actually just an attendee , or actually I take that back, I was a panel guest at that last one. I was like, I was a panel guest but I hadn’t done my panel yet, and like, there were photographers who knew who I was, and I was like, ‘Oh wow, that’s interesting.’ Because, they were watching something of mine even though I do a little bit of content around cameras and camera gear and photos and everything like that, but I specifically chose not to become a professional photographer to do other things. I'm not a pro filmmaker. Those things are passions of mine, and I teach what I do know about them and I mean, obviously, I use my gear every day. But, it was just so interesting that the perspective of not even who you would think was going to be a fan of yours or was going to really, what you say, was harder. But, seriously, it's like you never know, and so it's just like, it's a great responsibility. It's really fun and exciting, like you said, but boy, is it a little – When it stopped, when it’s you new normal, it’s intimidating. It’s a little weird. It’s like, ‘Oh wow.’” So, I guess what's interesting here is the fact that, you know, all of you in your own way, and me and my own way with the Print Forum at Rider Dickerson, what it all comes back to is the whole idea of the community, because none of this is possible without a community of people who want to take in that content, because you can put out all the content you want, but even Gary V, I mean, if he didn't have a community of people that followed him and embraced his content, it would just be an old adage, you know, if a tree falls and no one hears it, then it really falls. So, it's the whole idea of that community, and I know that Deborah, you're also a guest writer sometimes for a good friend of mine, you know, Mark Potter with CANVAS magazine. I connected you guys and he’s –
I don’t do that anymore, just so you know.” Yes, but you have. And, that was another way that you branched out, and he's a big believer in the whole idea too, right? And, he's built a community of followers in the print world, you know, when he started CANVAS. Trish has her community, a huge, Roberto’s got a massive community. So, that takes time though, and I think a lot of people and Gary talked about this all the time. They want to have that overnight success and they want to put out that video on YouTube and want it to go viral, and they want their content, they want their blog to get picked up and they want to get all the views and the impressions, and then they want to monetize it. How do I make money out of that? You know, they see Gary and they want to make all that money that he’s making. And, what people don't realize is that it takes a commitment, it takes an effort, and none of the three of you have gotten to where you are today without that hard work, and it takes time, and that's the message. I think a lot of people don't understand is that, you know, Deborah, like you mentioned it, I mean you, you started with 30 people and just an idea, and here you are today, and now all the big tradeshows want you to be there, you know, the printerverse, the Graph Expos, it’s like it’s a big deal, SGIA, Dscoop, all the places you go, but that didn't happen in a year.
Drupa. I’m going to drupa this year.” Drupa. I mean, my God, you’re going to Germany.
I can’t freaking believe it. I mean, thank you HP, is all I have to say because quite frankly, they got me before anybody else did. They were like, ‘Okay. This is just a real person talking to real people, and we want to be in on that.’ And, I thank them so, so much because quite frankly, their interests could mean other people say,
Well, she can't just be with them’, you know. But, to your point about community – Wait, what were you just saying just seconds ago?”
About the time it takes.”
Right. For three years, people asked me what I did and for three years, my response was, ‘I'm a professional networker’, and everyone just looked at me like I was insane, and the next question was, ‘And, how do you make money from that?’, and my response was, ‘I don't. I don't make a cent from it. However, there is something that's happening here and I'm in the middle of it, and I’m not going to turn my back on it because I'm not getting a dollar from it at this moment.’ I'm not – There's something about – Roberto, you said it before about helping people. That really is the underlying reason that I do what I do, because I can tell you honestly that I am not compensated for more of my time during the day than I’m compensated for my time, and that's because I am literally spending that time answering those emails that I get in LinkedIn about people looking for resources, about people looking for jobs. I mean, very topical subject. I'm not a recruiter, but I do, because I sit in the middle of all these people, I do know when there are opportunities out there. People looking for resources, for work especially, print buyers who don’t want to go public, because if they go public, they will get bombarded by the sales forces out there. So, they ask me and I essentially do my due diligence to help them find resources, but I looked at it as, ‘If I can’t monetize this hour, I will not be doing this, and if I didn't realize that there was a bigger value in serving a community than monetizing one, I would not be here right now.” That’s a great point Deborah.
That is the truth.”
I think people rush too quickly to monetize their message before they ever find their voice, before they ever have a grand vision of what they’re trying to accomplish. Like, people think – Like, some people still over glorify –and I understand why it’s impressive. Don't get me wrong as a marketer, I'm very proud of it, but as a human being, like I said, I’m more about, ‘Oh wow. This is how many people I serve.’ But like, people really hype up the YouTube thing, and I’m like, ‘Guys, understand that this is a means to an end.’ And, it’s not even just the means to an end of a business goal, I’m trying to do creative services. I'm disproportionately trying to take the current model of the attitude and the thought process of creative service professionals, both internally and externally. I want to take it out into the backyard like Old Yeller and I want to put it down. Okay? That's what I want to do, because creatives are going through depression and anxiety, they're struggling to get jobs, and some of it is not just the marketplace, some of it is their own freaking fault because they can't get out of their head, out of their own way. There's this overly important narrative to them of the starving artist. It has become a badge of honor, like a badge of honor, like no. I need to rip that off of their chest and like burn that thing in front of their face and say, ‘No, no. You like, understand your value and understand that you don't have the luxury of just being an artist. You owe it to yourself to respect your craft as a business. You owe it to your craft and to the people who came before you, to make this thing as valuable as possible and to understand what it's really worth.’ But then, also to the marketplace, to educate people to the fact that’s like, ‘No. You do not pay, you know, a print production person the same thing as you pay the guy loading, unloading stuff off the moving van. You don't. You really just don’t.’ And, the reason is: one, you're saying that the stakes aren’t high enough for you when you do that for what you're doing, which is then you saying to your customer, your consumer that, ‘I don't value your impression of me enough to put quality behind every execution of what represents my brand.’ And then also, you’re putting yourself in a position to where someone's not compensated enough to give you their best effort. So, it's about that re-education, and that's what my real goal is more than anything, and also knowing the shift in the marketplace in the economy that you can monetize in other ways, that employers have to step their game up to, or everyone's going to become a mercenary and just do it themselves, because they have direct access to the marketplace now. It's never been easier to build a brand. It's never been easier to build a business.”
I mean, just because you’re out there doesn't mean you have a brand, just to be clear about that.”
Absolutely. I’m just saying the barrier to entry, the cost to entry had never been lower. The technical ability you had to have to execute has never been lower. The amount of people it takes to run a business has never been less, because now we have technology and automation and all these resources, and the general public is also more educated about it or could more quickly be educated about it. The turnaround time on becoming profitable – You guys all know. We’re all old enough to know that in the world that like we used to live in 10 or 15 years ago, you could be in business five years and not be profitable and that would be normal.” Yes. That’s true.
My streak is a bit longer than that.” So, the word that keeps coming up here that’s interesting I serve, you know, serve the community. That’s interesting to me because in the last Blab that I did with Darcy and with Bob Burg who wrote The Go-Giver, you know, my favorite personal favorite book, he talks about in the book – It's interesting that you got to bringing this up. He talks about that, you know, the main character in the book talks about, you know, the first question is, ‘When you have an idea or a business idea or a new idea within your businesses, what good does it make money? Is it going to make me money?’ And, the theme in the book is: Well, that's a good question, but it’s not the first question. The first question is: Does it serve? Does it bring value? Right? So then, if it does, the money will follow. And, I've always lived my life that way in my profession, you know, in selling, you know. Deborah, you and I have talked enough about this to know that I'm all about – I talked about this at the beginning of the Blab that about adding value, and I certainly believe that if you do the right thing and if you bring value to your customers, the right customers are going to want to work with you and the money will follow. If I’m out there just trying to make commissions all day, that’s really a crappy way to do my job. Lord knows there’s enough sales reps that’s out there that do that, so, you know, I just choose not to, and I'm just a guy out there who happens to be in the print world doing what I do and just being authentic, being true to who I am. But, the idea of serving is interesting to me, because you each, you know, you're doing this for the right reasons. You're not out there trying to do it, and money is not the first thing on your mind. I mean, Deborah, obviously, you said it, you did it for three years and you were a networker and people said, ‘How do you make money?’
I do it today.” You do it today. It’s all about value.
You know, I was actually having this conversation with Trish before the Blab today, and I actually discourage people from advertising with me because I don't believe that I can serve them in the correct way. I use, you know, advertising on my site, in my newsletter, and to support conversations in content that is being provided to, again, serve the need of what's currently going on, and by that, I need topical and relevant content. There is a big difference between my site and like, industry sites, for example, who are serving the community in a different way with the, how things work, why they work, why, you know, the marketing, the economic forecasts and things like that. I focus on, ‘Okay, you have this stuff, what are you doing with it?’ and ‘what are your customers doing with it?’ and ‘how are you having conversations with them?’ and ‘what are they being receptive to?’ and ‘what are the things that they actually care about?’ So, consistently staying in that serving space opens up other doors that you probably won't know are there until you start doing it, but to your point, if your focus is strictly on, ‘I'm only going to do this if I make money. I'm only going to willing to – I mean, my site’s first goal would like Craigslist.’ They would just be flashing ad. It would look like a Las Vegas freaking slot machine. I mean, with all the dinging. I mean, I want nothing to do with anything. Now, does that make me a candidate for Wharton Business School? Probably not, because, you know, every day on my account, I’ve got to pay for my server, you know, which a lot of people would not believe, you know. But, the truth is that, my credibility with the community, them knowing to Roberto’s point that I’m really only talking about this, because I personally think it's freaking cool. Otherwise, I wouldn't be doing it. I’m not doing anything just to help anybody take a corporate message and take it from here and bring it here. There’s channels for that. But, if it's something that is relevant to everybody that I’m talking with and speaking with and engaging with, then it becomes relevant to me as well, and I can help push and pull those conversations so that they get the information that they need.”
And, I think that authenticity translates, you know. I was kind of talking about authenticity earlier about how I think people can tell when you really do want to help and when you're really there. I mean, obviously, everyone knows you’ve got to make money somehow but that, you know, you don’t sell out, you know you're authentic and your true to your audience, and for me it was all about a niche, really. I found a niche that I was interested in. I created the resources that I really wanted, that I felt as a designer didn’t exist. It took a very long time just to prove to the industry that there was a need for this category. I mean, you know. And, it started as folding, but what's happened over time – I mean, folding’s still my strongest kind of competency. It’s because I've been studying it for so long, but it's because I failed so many questions from viewers and people that I meet, it’s actually brought in into a lot of other research, and now I research and speak on direct mail, engagement strategy, generational preferences and marketing, I do a lot of work on millennial marketing, and I've started to package my content into a series called Event in a Box, where they are speaking events that are kind of contained, and they’ve got handouts and materials, and I’ve found that when you create so much content, you’ve got to kind of find a way to turn it into something. And, I think that's where it becomes, you know, ‘Okay. How do you turn it into things that people really want and that really help them, and that, you know, can create either a series or some amount of longevity?’ So, you know, it's led to lots of other things, but for me, it was really finding that niche and creating a following and establishing it in the industry and becoming kind of the person that everybody looks to for that category and kind of owning it, you know.”
I just want to say one thing about Trish presenting. We were at an event a couple weeks ago at the Advertising Projection Club of New York and first of all, talking about authenticity – You know, when Trish was showing these amazing pieces that she's highlighting for the fabulousness that is print, you know, she's telling you about, ‘Oh this one was great. I was pulling it for half an hour.’ So, you know that she really has an attachment to these things. They’re not just pieces that she’s propping up there because they serve some other purpose. Also, as far as serving the community – I'm sorry I have told story because it’s my favorite. Trish has just announced the fold files and anyone’s screaming out there, and when she announced it, it’s this really cool thing, just go to foldfactory.com and find it. Trust me, you'll freak. Anyhow, when she announced it at this event, it was like when OPRO was giving away cars. Remember? It was like, ‘You get a car.’ These people literally lost their minds in the audience. They’re like, ‘What? Oh my God! How do I get one of those?’ I mean, they were freaking out over this fold file. So, talk about understanding the community and serving a need and making front in service around what they are interested. This was the – I have never seen a product, that is for sale, mind you, got a standing ovation. ‘Yes, I want to but this from you.’ I had to give the guy in front of me my hand out with the information on it because he was freaking out. He’s like, ‘I don’t know how to get it. Where? Where? Where?’ I said, ‘Here you go sir.’ And he’s like, ‘No, you can’t get one.’ I’m like, ‘It’s okay. I’m sure I can get one from Trish. Okay.’ I mean, literally, the guy need a freaking Xanax. It was crazy. But, it's a perfect example of what we're talking about here.” Yes. And, I believe that. I mean, I personally have seen Trish. You know, Trish, I think what is it now, four or five times you’ve spoken at con?
Yes. Lots of fun vent.” And, you’ve covered it again, alright. You’ve spoken on everything from folding to direct mail.
Millennial marketing.” Yes. What’s interesting there is you’ve obviously been able to evolve in your brand to obviously being known as the ‘Folding Fanatic with the Cute T-shirt’ and all that stuff. And now, it's, you know, it's ‘I laugh everytime I see her without the t-shirt’. It’s still out of context for me, but –
What do you mean without? What? She’s just used other clothes on, correct?” Yes. Let’s be clear about that. It’s a family program.
Brady Bunch situation.”
That was actually the point of like, pivoting and rebranding as you find your voice and what your overall, your larger vision is, and also responding to what your community wants from you, and like, how you've grown in the relationship, because the thing is, your community will actually bring your best content of you. So many people say that the struggle with what to do or how to – Like, they’re like, ‘how do you keep coming up with content?’ or ‘how do you come up with ideas’ or ‘how do you be so consistent?’ It’s like, once there's a demand, it's not hard.”
You're right. You're right. And actually, one of my videos that’s had the most, one of the most watched videos was I had a viewer send me a note when USPS folded self-mailing standards were changed, and he sent me a note and he said, ‘You know, of all people I would think you'd have something to say on this. Are you putting out a video?’ And, it was like, ‘I haven’t thought to do that.’ So then, I was like, ‘You know what? I do need to put out a video about the new FSM standard.’ You know, it became a really kind of a go-to resource for the community, and it just was kind of this funny thing that came out of a viewer’s suggestions. So, it is. It’s your audience that starts to tell you where to go and, you know, the questions that they asked, the questions you get at events, the questions you get weekly or whatever or through email, really do lead you to kind of go into different areas. And, for my content, I kind of pivot it – I love the word pivot. Pivot it into direct mail because people were kind of saying, you know, they were asking me, ‘Well, can you give me some ideas for what I should choose for my format, for my project.’ And, I found I had to keep kind of stopping them and saying, ‘Well, you know, wait a minute. Who's your audience? What's your goal? Where are you? What are you trying to do? And then, I realized I needed to put format choice into context for people, into a workflow of ‘wait a minute’, you know. You start with your list and here’s how you make that happen and then, you know, poom, poom, poom, poom, further down the row, format. But, it was kind of putting it into context, really was what kind of made people connect the dots, and also, I think is helping people to be more strategic. And, I think now I look at everything. In the beginning, I was looking at everything just for format, for what it was and now, I look at everything from how engaging is it and what other engagement strategies are working, are in play right now in this format, and I think it's also made my presentations and my content richer, deeper, more effective, and so I think you do. You find that your audience leads you to your next, you know, body of content or your next kind of avenue as you go, which is kind of neat.”
Before we go to deep with anything else, you know, what I think would be the most helpful to the live audience when they were watching the replay, because we've gone like a lot all over the place, let's talk about some actual ways to leverage content and monetize content, and even speak to our own strategies and personal experience with that, because I think that we have a lot of like – Maybe not this audience, but I think in general. Like, there are cynics out there who don't believe in this, and they're very much adamant about, businesses exist to make money, businesses exist to make money, and I would caution them to remember that Blockbuster wanted to make money too. Look at where they are and everything like that, because they didn't listen when we're all whining about why not wanting to drive out in the rain, show up and the video not being there, get something because we don’t want to leave empty handed, go back home, really not be interested in watching it, watch it the last day, yet they're closing and then have to pay late fees the next day, like, versus, ‘Oh, click a button. I've got it.’ Like, they didn't listen, and then they thought arrogantly, ‘You know, we’ve been in business for 25 years. This Netflix thing, you know, we're not going to buy them out. They're not going to beat us. We'll just try and steal the same thing and everything like that, after we’ve already solid our reputation, after they’ve already dominated in that space. Yes, we can just mimic them. It'll be fine.’ Where are they now? Oh, wait! Nowhere to be found. Wait, their entire, not just them, their entire business model evaporated in less than five years, because they didn’t listen. They wanted to make money. They didn’t want to create value.”
Kodak, anyone? Film? Cameras? Digital cameras, digital cameras.” I’d go one step further with that too. Let’s just stick into the print industry. I look at a company like Heidelberg. You know, Heidelberg lead – I mean, Heidelberg was the ‘be all and all’. I mean, you went to Graph Expo years ago, you walked through that floor. Heidelberg owned the front of that show floor, right?
You buy Heidelberg.” Right. Now, that show is not owned by Heidelberg anymore.
Yes. But, I’m sorry, I would have to argue with you that when you’re Heidelberg, you don’t need to go to a trade show, just like you don't get direct mail for Lamborghinis.” No, you don't, but I would argue and tell you that Heidelberg missed out on the digital revolution, and that HP steal it right from underneath them.
That's a different story. But, whether or not to spend money on going to a trade show when everyone knows who you are, versus, just quite frankly, look at their business model as the pivot which is, ‘Let me bring the qualified people I know can actually afford these presses and have a need for them, specifically market to them, specifically invite them to event tailored for them, show them exactly what they could be producing in their wheelhouse, show them the vertical markets they can serve with the same machine and spend the money that way.”
I mean, when a company said, ‘Let's sell our consumer technology to Sony and let’s just go and focus on our microscopes and telescopes with the government and NASA. Hell, let’s do that, and here are our consumer-grade technology and pens, here you go Sony, you go have fun with that.”
Right. So, it’s a pivot?” It is a pivot. So, my point with Heidelberg was that – I mean, look at Dscoop. Look at what HP's done Dscoop. Dscoop is their user’s community, right? I mean, it's a brilliant idea, and quite honestly, it was the inspiration for Print Forum for me, you know, building a community that same way. Everything I've done with Print Forum, I kind of took my inspiration from Dscoop, and it was a brand idea by HP. And, to your point Deborah, about listening to your community and giving them a place where they could have discussions and they could bring ideas to that community. So, the idea of listening, and Roberto, it’s so funny you mentioned that word, listening, because I was going to – When Trish was talking about shifting and pivoting her content, I really do think it comes down to listening constantly, whether you're in a profession like mine where I'm day-to-day dealing with clients, and I have to always be listening constantly, because that's where you're going to get your greatest insight. It’s listening to your customers or like you guys, listening to your audience and engaging what is of interest to them, and pivoting, right? So, and again, back to Gary V, he talks about that all the time. That's why he's so engaged with his community because he’s always wondering putting out content and seeing what they're really engaging with and what people are posting comments on, and shame on you if you're not taking action on that engagement. So, that word really comes back to the forefront for me there, is the idea of listening and engaging. And, you guys do such a great job of it. There's enough people out there on Twitter and they're just posting comments and they post stuff and they never engage with their followers and they never listen to them.
I think there's a lot of noise out there right now. So, the challenge is to stay authentic and unique and valuable, you know, and to provide content that people actually are willing to stop and look at and listen to or whatever, and something that they look forward to. I think the struggle that companies have – Like, we’re individuals, right? Dean, you’re a writer, but I mean, the rest of us are – We’re individuals kind of in control of what we're doing, you know. I put out what I want to put out, you know. There's nobody kind of saying, ‘We’ll run that through legal first.’ And, they make sure you do this and make sure you do that. I think what a lot of times companies have trouble with is content. When it’s hard to attribute its kind of monetary value, you know? It's a marketing expense. You know, you’re paying – If they're paying writers or if they’ve got a team doing this, it’s hard to, I think, often attribute it to the bottom line, you know, and money coming in, and so I think it's hard from that standpoint.”
Less than you would think, I think is that they purposefully choose to have that narrative, because they choose not to educate themselves on it so that they can continue doing what they're comfortable with, and I think I've seen a lot. Because, the thing is, think about how hard it was and how hard it is to measure the value of having a freaking bill border any other OO agent, for those who are not in the know, out-of-home advertising, right? And romantically, they realize that billboards, and Gary V brings this up, and like, I didn't even mean to bring him into this part of the conversation, because I was just thinking of it, because I used to do billboards for the ad agency. I did like, the HBO boxing stop for Times Square. But, thinking about in front of a marketing, then you like them and they’re HBO. Yes, that makes sense. But, if you're someone who's not HBO, still the crème de la crème of businesses, they’ll be able to say, ‘Oh yes, we've got a billboard downtown’ or ‘Oh, we’ve got a billboard off of Highway 95’ or whatever. And, it's like, ‘Why do billboards in age when everyone’s still looking at their smartphones as they drive by, still costs what they cost five years ago, ten years ago, fifteen years ago? Why is that? Why is that still that valuable?’ It's because people are still spending money on it and still willing to spend that money on it, and not because that’s any measurable ROI, but because it’s what they're comfortable with and because in their mind, it associates with prestige. Print ads without leveraging a QR code or a unique website URL to track, because you can make print measurable if you want to. And, we did an article about that if I'm not mistaken. You can make print measurable, and I'm not throwing print under the bus, what I'm saying is that romantically, people are not thinking of going this other way of saying, ‘Well, can I make QR codes interesting?’ Because, guess what? Snapchat is crushing it with their snap code, which is just a glorified QR code. So, it's not impossible to – or why not use it as a brand? Why not use it in your print thing, your snap code, if you want reach millennials, if that's who your audience is and everything, and put that in your print ad or even in your freaking billboard, and have a unique story of the day curated through there or even have an influence or take over the account for them. This is why influencer marketing is going to crush it, because of all the people like us, it's going to work, because just like you said, ‘If they decided to just outsource it to us, the legal ramifications of just hiring an influencer are much less, than dealing with the red tape approval of multiple managers in multiple departments and a CEO, and it's also cheaper. It's also cheaper to leverage an influencer than to sit there and have to pay multiple people on a marketing team to do that particular thing, and then run the day-to-day internal operations, and your marketing team can just go to auditing basically.” Yes. So, we've got just a couple minutes left here, and I’m really interested to get each of you to comment on this. So, we've covered a lot of ground and it has been a great conversation. It really has been. Tell me, each of you, what excites you about the next coming years in terms of, in perspective to your businesses and what we're talking about here with content and platforms for engagement? Deborah, you start. What excites you the most?
I mean, honestly, I have to say that going to drupa is something that I really feel that I'm going for everybody here. I mean, I’m going for my people, and as much as – I am specifically going there to work with HP’s PageWide Press. Those are the high-speed inkjet presses. And, I will be there helping them to – They’re working with a bunch of partners there, so I will be there to help the community understand how everyone's working together. But, when possible, I plan on taking my video camera and walking around and see as much as I can, so that everybody else can be with me there. And, I’ll be taking— I don't want to call them requests, but literally, what does everybody want to see? I mean, I’m sure we could all name the top five things that I'm sure Mr. Landis’ booth is number one is. There’s going to be press, you know. But, I plan on doing as much Periscoping as possible, as much video, as much tweeting, social media. I mean, beyond my responsibilities there, to really give as much of that experience, not give it, but literally share with everybody, because I am very lucky that I get to go to these events now. But, as you know, sitting in an advertising agency, it’s like, the production people don’t go anywhere. We don’t even get to go for lunch. No one’s going to send me to freaking Germany for three weeks, you know. They’re not going to send me to Chicago. They’re not even going to let me go to the Javits Center, you know, so it’s not happening. And, of course, it's in Europe, so there's all the – just the Americans in general don't get to go. So, I am looking at this opportunity as so much bigger than myself. I will do all the work, everything I need to do so that HP is happy of course, and then I am running the hell all over that show to see as much as possible and share as much as I possibly can with everybody.” That’s great. Trish, what about you? What excites you about all the stuff we’ve talked about and going forward about your business and your community? What’s got you excited for the coming couple of years there?
Well, you know, what I would say I’m most excited about is, I think for a while, everything was digital, digital, you know. Everything was you know, ‘Read this.’ I think there's kind of a rediscovery of tangible media that's happening now. We're all absorbing, you know, processing like eight hours a day of media, and most of it is digital, and so there's like this rediscovery of print where tangible media has meaning. There you go.”
That’s a book everybody. That’s a book.”
Right. And, I just feel like it's a huge opportunity where people are kind of saying, ‘Wait a minute, I actually do look forward to my print. I do look forward.’ And, there’s neuroscience behind all this that’s proving it as well, and so, I think we we've got this wonderful opportunity to kind of leverage the strength of that, and I feel like I can go out, I can be an advocate of it. I feel like people understand what I'm doing now. I feel like I was a little bit ahead of my time, you know, in the earlier days, and I feel like print finishing has caught up, digital print has caught up. You can do amazing things with digital. You can still do amazing things with offset, you know. I mean, look at what's happening with inkjet. Just everything has kind of picked up speed and packaging and large-format, you name it. So, I just feel like it's all about print right now, and I'm excited to be in that environment. I don't know. I'm excited to be an advocate for the industry and I'm excited to, instead of having, you know, at the end of a presentation like, ‘Oh well. You know we love what you're doing, but we can't do that, and this can’t be possible.’ Now, it's like, people are like, ‘Wait a minute. This is awesome, you know. Let's do this. I want to try it. I want to do something new.’ I just feel like there's tremendous momentum with what can be done, and I don’t know. It’s just exciting. It’s an exciting time. I feel like things have kind of all connected and you know, I know where I’m going and ride the wave. It’s fun.” Yes. You're speaking to the choir there. Roberto, what about you?
I’m definitely living in exciting times. I mean, this past year has been really exciting for me. I'm really looking forward to doing more speaking engagements, attending more conferences, and doing the video and the behind-the-scenes and doing the interview stuff. I love that. I'm really excited to be writing my book, the Just Create Awesome Book: Building a Mindset for Creative Success. That’s going to be a really – It's an undertaking in and of itself, but I'm so excited about it, and I'm so excited that I decided to make the decision to actually interview a bunch of these other creative professionals that are going to be featured in the book. People like Sui Zimmerman, Amy Smithower, Tyler Rockson. It’s going to be, like, fantastic, and it’s going to help so many people in my community. It’s going to bring so many more people to my community, and like, I'm really excited about the fact that with what I've been able to do, I’ve been able to get people, whether they're print professionals or web designers or photographers or videographers, to actually start talking to each other and actually understanding what they have in common, instead of just sitting in their own silo in their own zone. So, like personally, I'm really excited about that. As far as where things are going, I'm really excited about something we never touched on here, which is I'm really excited about augmented reality and VR, and I think that it's actually going to help print a lot, because I think that print and I also think things going on with 3D printing and I think that, like, with print material and with out-of-home advertising, this is why I am excited about the value of out-of-home advertising. I'm interested in it as a trigger for virtual reality experiences. I’m interested in print products triggering VR, and so I think that print is going to get really exciting there, because print becomes very practical and affordable when you start thinking about it in those kind of terms as a gateway media. And, I think that that's going to be so cool, and then marketers are going to ruin it.” Marketers only tried. They tried to ruin it with QR codes, and everyone jumped in and was using it in the worst ways possible.
They ruined them in the US but not abroad.” No. It's true.
If you're in Asia, shopping is really convenient with a QR code. If I had that here, oh my God, I wish I could just like, you know, be walking around somewhere, and then there's just nothing but products and QR code is like, ‘Oh my God! I need to pitch Amazon on print kiosk.’”
Yes. It's going to be sensors. There’s no need for a code anymore. It's just going to be sensors.”
You're not wrong. That's the evolution of it. I think that’s the real evolution of it, and then with QR, I think the evolution of it is then being able to actually get like a 360 view of the product and everything like that, which ‘Oh my God. The unboxing guys are going hate this.’”
Everything is going to work off your cellphone camera. You’re not going to need to do anything. You’re just going to point at it, and it’s going to take you to the shops you can buy this outfit from, the shoes that go with it. It’ll be crazy. But, I know we have to go. Dean will wrap it up.” No, it’s fine. This has been awesome. We got to do this again. So, you guys, thanks to everyone. We had a lot of viewers who thought and announced that this was great. Roberto, thanks for joining our posse for today and rounding it up. That’s great.
Thank you for having me.” Yes, absolutely.
People should move #PrintChat to Blab. Have you thought about that, Deb?”
No. No. No. No. No. Don’t anybody listen. I have enough time with the time change. I’m not having a little patient change. I lost all of Europe yesterday, and Australia. It’s too early. The Australians cannot get up at 5 o’clock in the morning. They get up at 6 o’clock. So, for the next three weeks, #PrintChats all over the place.”
Debbie will be like, ‘Curse you farmers.’”
I did the other day. Christina was going crazy with the farmers.” Well, that’s it. You guys have a great rest of your week, and I guess, thanks for popping in with me. This was fun, alright guys.
Thank you. Thanks so much for inviting us.” Alright, guys. Everyone have a great day.
Bye. Trish, just log out.” See you Trish. Bye guys. Bye Trish